|
Post by Dinotoyforum on Feb 24, 2009 0:41:26 GMT
I'm going to make is so that each diorama has a title (be creative) and entrants will list how they photo was produced. (the equivalent of "oil on canvas" that accompanies other forms of art. Like I said, the artistic, technical, creative and scientific merits will be judged by the voters. i.e. you. If you think using p-shop is cheating for example, or using catalogue shots is a sham, or the presence of grass in the Jurassic is a heresy, you can take that into account when voting. Everyone is different regarding these things so it should not be for the organisers to impose regulations. It's something we couldn't police anyway - a good photoshop is invisible.
Personally, I think photoshopping is a skill in of itself and difficult to do well (like photography) - so it won't effect my voting.
|
|
|
Post by stoneage on Feb 24, 2009 1:11:12 GMT
Well did Boki use photoshop. Maybe he photoshopped some extra Diplodocus, but he may have had more then one. I don't know about photoshop, but I'd just like to take a picture. You can still try to get some effects without using photoshop. I think it is possible to judge on the merit of the effort. I'd just like to do one. Some people won't enter if they can't photoshop, others won't enter if they have to photoshop. I think the more entrees the better. ;D
|
|
|
Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Feb 24, 2009 1:31:00 GMT
Well did Boki use photoshop. Maybe he photoshopped some extra Diplodocus, but he may have had more then one. I don't know about photoshop, but I'd just like to take a picture. You can still try to get some effects without using photoshop. I think it is possible to judge on the merit of the effort. I'd just like to do one. Some people won't enter if they can't photoshop, others won't enter if they have to photoshop. I think the more entrees the better. ;D That's basically what we and DTF are thinking--- let there be plenty of dioramas! Much more than a measly seven.
|
|
|
Post by dinonikes on Feb 24, 2009 1:37:32 GMT
I just want to put in my two cents here- I don't care one way or the other regarding the rules of the contest- but I just want to clarify something- I am a professional diorama maker-I have been for the past 25 years-(that's why i disqualified myself from entering the contest) there IS a definition of what a diorama is and what it isn't- a diorama is a three dimensional recreation of a given scene- when you photoshop you are not making dioramas- whatever you want to call them is your business really- but they AREN'T dioramas- you are making photo motages which is the technical term for what you are doing- they are graphics- we have a Graphic department at work that does what you are doing- they do not make dioramas and would never call them that- look at it this way-would photoshopped imagery be allowed in the drawing contest? I don't think so- just so we are clear-here is a photo OF A DIORAMA-
|
|
|
Post by dinonikes on Feb 24, 2009 1:42:21 GMT
I just reread my post and it seems hostile which is NOT how i intended it at all- just wanted to define what I consider a diorama-
|
|
|
Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Feb 24, 2009 2:05:32 GMT
Well, since they are all pictures... They would all be graphic images. Although you do make a good point dinonikes.
|
|
|
Post by stoneage on Feb 24, 2009 2:21:43 GMT
I just want to put in my two cents here- I don't care one way or the other regarding the rules of the contest- but I just want to clarify something- I am a professional diorama maker-I have been for the past 25 years-(that's why i disqualified myself from entering the contest) there IS a definition of what a diorama is and what it isn't- a diorama is a three dimensional recreation of a given scene- when you photoshop you are not making dioramas- whatever you want to call them is your business really- but they AREN'T dioramas- you are making photo motages which is the technical term for what you are doing- they are graphics- we have a Graphic department at work that does what you are doing- they do not make dioramas and would never call them that- look at it this way-would photoshopped imagery be allowed in the drawing contest? I don't think so- just so we are clear-here is a photo OF A DIORAMA- I just want to say I love your dioramas. I just wish I was rich enough to buy them! ;D
|
|
|
Post by crazycrowman on Feb 24, 2009 2:40:30 GMT
I agree with you 100% Dinonikes - That is a lovely diorama as well
|
|
|
Post by sbell on Feb 24, 2009 3:12:43 GMT
1)I do believe that Boki actually had 4 diplo's--based on the feet and ensuing effect in the water.
2) So Cordy--are you claiming that this is not, in fact, a diorama contest, but a graphic arts contest?
3) I am actually all for trying to increase the number of entries, and I think that the required info is a good start. But I do think that two other things should be required--one, what the figures are (Maker/animal; and how many real ones/reproduced ones there are); and two, the source of anything that is not owned by the entrant (otherwise, what's to stop someone from sneaking in WwD and Battat figures that hey don't own?). The entries are anonymous until after, so the voters would never know who pulled a Worth 1000 using Google images versus someone that actually created a diorama.
|
|
|
Post by dinonikes on Feb 24, 2009 3:19:43 GMT
Sometimes I can come off sounding like a crabby old man- lol- not my intention- I was more just trying to be a stickler for defining a term- I do like the 'dioramas' that i have seen here posted- the water effect with the clear plastic wrap wouldn't work as well in person- so i do see the value of the photoshop technique-the blurring of the water was a nice touch to eliminate the fact that it was clear plastic - I usually don't like to look at things in such black and white terms- I will admit to being a bit 'protective' maybe of dioramas as they are my bag- I am gettting older and see that I am slowly becoming a 'dinosaur' in this computer world-
|
|
|
Post by dinonikes on Feb 24, 2009 3:33:29 GMT
1)I do believe that Boki actually had 4 diplo's--based on the feet and ensuing effect in the water. 2) So Cordy--are you claiming that this is not, in fact, a diorama contest, but a graphic arts contest? 3) I am actually all for trying to increase the number of entries, and I think that the required info is a good start. But I do think that two other things should be required--one, what the figures are (Maker/animal; and how many real ones/reproduced ones there are); and two, the source of anything that is not owned by the entrant (otherwise, what's to stop someone from sneaking in WwD and Battat figures that hey don't own?). The entries are anonymous until after, so the voters would never know who pulled a Worth 1000 using Google images versus someone that actually created a diorama. Very good point- I would think that entrants would be using figures that they have at least- hard to disprove one way or the other though-I agree that one could just grab any toy images from the internet and assemble them into a dioramic image- I really think that would not be in the spirit of what these dioramas are supposed to be(at least how i take it)in the first place (based on dioramas that members post on a regular basis)- shouldn't this be a creative form of enjoying, CELEBRATING, sharing, the pieces in your collection and not just random prehistoric images culled from who knows where? I do agree that it would be very hard to police such notions in this age of the photo touched image- I guess probably better to just let it be free reign as far as entering and let the voters decide-as DTF has stated previously-
|
|
|
Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Feb 24, 2009 3:35:44 GMT
1)I do believe that Boki actually had 4 diplo's--based on the feet and ensuing effect in the water. 2) So Cordy--are you claiming that this is not, in fact, a diorama contest, but a graphic arts contest? 3) I am actually all for trying to increase the number of entries, and I think that the required info is a good start. But I do think that two other things should be required--one, what the figures are (Maker/animal; and how many real ones/reproduced ones there are); and two, the source of anything that is not owned by the entrant (otherwise, what's to stop someone from sneaking in WwD and Battat figures that hey don't own?). The entries are anonymous until after, so the voters would never know who pulled a Worth 1000 using Google images versus someone that actually created a diorama. Boki owns two diplos I think, I only saw two of them in his collection pics, not four. I think he just positioned his two in different poses and took a bunch of different photos of them. And it would be fair (unless of course somebody else used a picture that wasn't theirs, but that will be explained in the rules....) for some people to be able to use photoshop and other to not use it. Either way, you can still make good dios-- Just look at boki's (which are almost all natural) and tomhet's (which are almost all 'shopped). Besides people, this is a contest of people taking pictures of toy plastic dinosaurs. Is everybody being a lil' to serious? ;D
|
|
|
Post by bokisaurus on Feb 24, 2009 5:22:04 GMT
Wow, interesting how my diorama entry last year sparked a discussion ;D I think you all already know what I consider a diorama based on my post. I may have used photoshop for the final product, but it's a combination of multiple photos taken specifically for the vision I have of what I wanted to do. And yes, took a lot of time to put it all together and pull it off ( I think I pulled it off, yea?). Honestly I try to take photographs of my figures in a diorama sort of settings, make them more interesting looking, right stoneage? ;D I think everyone here who have seen my dioramas already know my style, so it would be very hard to disguise what ever I enter ;D
|
|
|
Post by Meso-Cenozoic on Feb 24, 2009 10:29:11 GMT
Ooooh, I'm in!! It will be my first Diorama Contest!!! And, my two cents worth (and that's about all it's worth in the US today, LOL then cries!) on the Photoshop vs. Real-Life Dios....... The only real issue I see, that's been mentioned above several times, is the use in photoshop of things one doesn't have. I think, whether using actual or photoshopped dioramas, everything in the picture, you should actually have/own. Now, I think it's alright if you duplicate some of your dinos or foliage and such, but you should at least have one of each in real life. I don't think you should be able to use backgrounds or anything else off the internet. I think it would be more fair that you create your own backgrounds and such and then if you see fit, play with them in photoshop. But, I don't think, for example, it would be fair if one pulls a cool ocean backdrop from a professionally taken pic off the internet and another tries to create the image themselves. There would be no comparison which one would look more realistic! Anyway, I think the point has been made. So, now I'll just sit back and put on my thinking cap, while I await the final detailed plans, guidelines and rules. I'm not the best, when it comes to understanding everything on my digital camera. But, I'll sure give it my best shot! (pun intended, lol!) ;D Oh, and a PS to Malcolm..... That dio of your's ROCKS!
|
|
|
Post by Dinotoyforum on Feb 24, 2009 18:36:54 GMT
look at it this way-would photoshopped imagery be allowed in the drawing contest? I don't think so But why not? ;D The vast majority of my illustrations are photoshopped to some degree. A typical example is this Bary, www.plesiosauria.com/baryonyx.jpgOriginally I felt the S-curve to the neck was too much so I changed it in Photoshop (you can even see it is a bit blurry, that wouldn't happen these days). Is the subsequent image no longer an illustration because photoshop was used to tweak it? How much photoshop is too much? It's a fuzzy issue. www.plesiosauria.com/baryonyxmod2.jpgI agree though, the contest will be using an overly broad concept of 'dioramas' that strictly speaking surpasses the strict definition. It's an interesting topic and I appreciate everyone's views Sorry for the delay in the official announcement, it's coming soon - I'm just so busy. Cordy has worked out a preliminary announcement, I just need to update it and post it...won't be long now...
|
|
|
Post by Meso-Cenozoic on Feb 24, 2009 21:16:10 GMT
Wow, Adam! I don't remember seeing that pic before.
I would love a figure of that Bary! (Hint, hint, Malcolm!!)
And, I agree about the "tweaking" in photoshop. I don't think that's a big deal. Just using sources that aren't yours, I think that might not be very fair.
|
|
|
Post by Tyrannax on Feb 25, 2009 0:18:20 GMT
I think it'd be very unfair. If this a Photoshopped images contest that tests our computer skills or a diorama contest? ;D
|
|
|
Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Feb 25, 2009 0:41:39 GMT
Would anybody here actually do such a thing? I can't think of anyone..
|
|
|
Post by Meso-Cenozoic on Feb 25, 2009 2:25:50 GMT
Are you joking, CT, that's what you're doing now -- using backgrounds from already composed pics! Not to say that you would for the contest. Just saying that it has been done.
|
|
|
Post by dinonikes on Feb 25, 2009 3:27:38 GMT
I think that it is best to just let eveyone enter whatever they want and let the votes decide the winners, voters can decide what they feel is deserving of their vote- DTF has already touched on this and it seems the only way to not discourage entries- and to alleviate the need for a rule book to enter-
|
|