Did dinosaurs ever live in snow?

[gojulasprime23]

Something I'm curious about- did dinosaurs ever have to live in snow or freezing environments? I know the earth was much warmer during that time, but there is speculation that there may have been snow in the mountains of certain regions. If there were any species that would have lived in such an environment, I think it would be a great visual.
I've often seen Crylophosaurus depicted in wintery scenes, but I have a feeling that was unlikely.
I'd like to know what you all think.

[bucketfoot]

Well, we know that there were some dinosaurs that lived year-round in Antarctica and Alaska - they were warmer then of course, and housed temperate rainforests - but during the long 6-month Arctic winters, no doubt temperatures had to fall near or below freezing at times.

So as far as I know, the answer is - maybe. Did they ever live in snow like Polar Bears and Megafauna we don't know. But we do know that they did live in some places that got as cold as anywhere at the time.

We need some paleo-climatologists to chime in here. Perhaps an inquiry on the DML is in order. I'll get back to you on it.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Well it's certainly possible for warm-blodded animals like dinosaurs to exist in colder habitats..how cold and how long..you might want to ask elsewhere.

I know that one episode of WWD had the dinos in some light snow and frosty weather conditions.

Surely the tops of mountains would have wintery conditions for most if not all of the year..so some smaller species could have lived there.

[sepp]

it would make sense that some dinosaurs lived in colder climates - mountain regions, antarctica, etc.

also, a good chunk of Raptor Red takes place in the snowy mountains. not like that means it's scientific fact, but still, reasonable speculation.

[stoneage]

I'm sure there were Dinosaurs that lived in areas where it sometimes snowed, Sometimes it snows in Florida. Alligators can live frozen in ice for a few days. I suspect Dinosaurs may have been even more adaptable to temperature change. I don't think they ever had to deal with anything like todays antarctic though.

[[][][]cordylus[][][]]

I bet in deserts such as where velociraptor lived it could get below freezing at night and get a little frosty.

[Griffin]

I remember my professor talking about how there is evidence that some dinosaurs may have lived at least part of their lives in a relatively cold environment. I know plenty of large reptiles today can live through cold seasons like Tegus and such. If they can do it, then dinosaurs def could do it too, especially if they were indeed endothermic in some way.

[Horridus]

Dec 5, 2009 18:19:53 GMT Griffin said:

If they can do it, then dinosaurs def could do it too, especially if they were indeed endothermic in some way.

Indeed. In fact, feathered dinosaurs continue to live in cold environments to this day. Like England.

[stoneage]

Dec 5, 2009 18:30:24 GMT Horridus said:

Dec 5, 2009 18:19:53 GMT Griffin said:

If they can do it, then dinosaurs def could do it too, especially if they were indeed endothermic in some way.

Indeed. In fact, feathered dinosaurs continue to live in cold environments to this day. Like England.

England, what about Penguins! I remember seeing something not too long ago that seemed to show that Dinosaurs may have been more warm blooded then Archosaurs but less so then modern birds. I think its on the blog somewhere?

[Horridus]

Dec 5, 2009 18:35:01 GMT stoneage said:

England, what about Penguins!

A joke firstly, and secondly there were no Mesozoic penguin-equivalents as far as I'm aware! (I mean, there were no permanent polar ice caps, were there?)
Also, yeah, I've heard that the metabolism of dinosaurs varied quite a lot. Most theropods seem to have had endothermic metabolisms while there's evidence that a lot of herbivorous dinosaurs were closer to modern-day reptiles.
I remember in and old NHM dino book they compared 'growth rings' in the bones of Baryonyx and Iguanodon, and found that while Baryonyx showed signs of being a warm-blooded, active animal, Iguanodon looked closer to, er, an iguana. Still, dinosaurs must have been more active than modern reptiles as a whole - their upright carriage is enough evidence.

[gojulasprime23]

Thanks for all of the comments thus far- this is something I haven't read much about.
The main reason I ask is that I am planning on doing a small painting for a holiday greeting to send via email to family and acquaintances. So I'm trying to put together a themed dinosaur scene with snow. I gather therapods would be most appropriate to use (velociraptors perhaps?) as they probably had a very high metabolism. I'd also have to include some sort of prehistoric tree that could resemble a pine tree. And lastly, perhaps have some fireflies buzzing around in a scene at dusk, perhaps with an aurora in the night sky. I have yet to research if there were any fireflies back then so I may take some liberties if I need to, but at the same time I'd like to have this as plausible as possible while still making for a good holiday greeting.

[Horridus]

A Troodon might be a good idea. Late Cretaceous, found in cooler regions. Also feathered and with a 'sickle claw', just not such a pronounced one.

I wouldn't worry about the fireflies. It's a Christmas card and they would look cool.

[Radman]

Here is your classic "Dinosaur in the snow" pic:



From the WWD book, there is a whole chapter on dinos that lived in occasional freezing conditions on the Australian/ Antarctic supercontinent, although the focus is on Leallynasaura.
I think something like this would make a very nice x-mas card

[Horridus]

Ah yes, also featured Muttaburrasaurus and a dwarf allosaur...quite a good episode. I think the episode itself was called 'Spirits of the Ice Forest'.

[stoneage]

Dec 5, 2009 19:35:40 GMT gojulasprime23 said:

Thanks for all of the comments thus far- this is something I haven't read much about.
The main reason I ask is that I am planning on doing a small painting for a holiday greeting to send via email to family and acquaintances. So I'm trying to put together a themed dinosaur scene with snow. I gather therapods would be most appropriate to use (velociraptors perhaps?) as they probably had a very high metabolism. I'd also have to include some sort of prehistoric tree that could resemble a pine tree. And lastly, perhaps have some fireflies buzzing around in a scene at dusk, perhaps with an aurora in the night sky. I have yet to research if there were any fireflies back then so I may take some liberties if I need to, but at the same time I'd like to have this as plausible as possible while still making for a good holiday greeting.

www.documentaryfilms.net/Reviews/WalkingWithDinosaurs/5SpiritsoftheIceForest.htm

Velociraptor lived in a desert enviornment.

www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/arcticdino/prod-04.html

Here are some Dinosaurs from Alaska. NOVA had a video on it.

[gojulasprime23]

Ah yes the Leaellynasaura from WWD- I actually have that book/ DVD.
I forgot about that part.
Seems like they're little smaller than I want to use . I like the Troodon idea- they were found in Alaska so that could work.

Now I gotta look at some trees...

[foxilized]

Just wondering... could they have developed some hair? If therapsyds and pterosaurs could.....

[Horridus]

Dec 6, 2009 21:42:25 GMT foxilized said:

Just wondering... could they have developed some hair? If therapsyds and pterosaurs could.....

The primitive feathers found on dinosaurs like Sinosauropteryx would probably have resembled hair in life. However they weren't actually hair, as that's found only on mammals. Pterosaur 'hair' was similar to mammalian hair, in appearance and function but not exactly the same. It's an example of convergent evolution.

And therapsids are mammals...well, mammals and their ancestors...

[stoneage]

Dec 6, 2009 22:05:39 GMT Horridus said:

Dec 6, 2009 21:42:25 GMT foxilized said:

Just wondering... could they have developed some hair? If therapsyds and pterosaurs could.....

The primitive feathers found on dinosaurs like Sinosauropteryx would probably have resembled hair in life. However they weren't actually hair, as that's found only on mammals. Pterosaur 'hair' was similar to mammalian hair, in appearance and function but not exactly the same. It's an example of convergent evolution.

And therapsids are mammals...well, mammals and their ancestors...

;D There are those that feel the the hair imprints attributed to Pterosaurs are actually collagen fibers. ( A structural fiber found in muscle fibers in the wing membranes)

[Horridus]

Dec 6, 2009 23:01:15 GMT stoneage said:

;D There are those that feel the the hair imprints attributed to Pterosaurs are actually collagen fibers. ( A structural fiber found in muscle fibers in the wing membranes)

In some cases this is true, but it can't be said for the likes of Sordes.