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Post by robban on Aug 31, 2011 19:55:00 GMT
The T. rex had huge teeth, although not as long as those on BHI 3033 "Stan skull". If you compare Stan to other T. rex skulls the difference is noticable. Perhaps BHI chose to let the teeth protrude so much inorder for it to look more terrifyng? I've made a little example below which shows the skull of Stan. From top to bottom: 1. original skull 2. recessed teeth (to match those of other T. rex skulls) 3. closed jaw 4. fleshed out, with some degree of lips  I'm planning on making my own T. rex sculpt, and I have no idea whether to add lips or not. IMO the lower jaw was way too narrow for it to have lips that were big enough to hide the teeth in the upper jaw. But who knows? |
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Post by dinonikes on Aug 31, 2011 20:45:21 GMT
Its all up to you whether you add lips to your sculpt or not, but I agree that the physical aspects of the T.Rex jaw really make it seem to me that there is no way the lower jaw had lips. Not only is the length of the upper teeth a question but the distance they satnd out from the lower jaw causes issues regarding lower lips. To have lower lips, they would have to extend way out past those upper teeth, as there really isnt room for them to go inside the upper teeth when the jaw is closed. Animals dont seem to naturally have overbites where the upper teeth overlap the lower lips like that. Most animals with lips seems to have teeth that meet close to each other upper to lower. One could argue that Smilodon shows that teeth can cause exceptions to be made, the canines jutting out like that, but that is a mammal which have extremely developed lips, and not just scale coverings like lizards- like you said, who really knows, its all preference. I doubt there would be lips on just the upper jaw, or partial lips, animals either have lips or no lips it seems, I am not aware of any halfway measures like that on any modern animals.
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Post by sid on Aug 31, 2011 22:01:42 GMT
I guess Rex had lizard-like lips but not as developed as in varanids (roughly like in JP), mainly to protect the gums and teeth. Or maybe not, but considering their jaw structure, most if not all theropod had their upper teeth sticking out.
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Post by robban on Aug 31, 2011 22:20:11 GMT
I would say it is probably a bigger chance that T. rex was lip-less. Did its jaws resemble those of a crocodile? Looking at a skull of a crocodile, the area between the teeth is rather round/smooth in shape whereas on T. rex the line is quite sharp. The T. rex also has several small holes along the jaw line which are non-present on a crocodile jaw. This is what makes me hesitate a bit about it being completely lip-less. However this sculpture of a lip-less Sue certainly looks convincing!   |
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Post by dinonikes on Aug 31, 2011 22:43:37 GMT
I guess Rex had lizard-like lips but not as developed as in varanids (roughly like in JP), mainly to protect the gums and teeth. Or maybe not, but considering their jaw structure, most if not all theropod had their upper teeth sticking out. I find it sort of interesting that although therapods are not directly related (I may be wrong here) to veranids, I have heard people use the argument that since their teeth are so similar to therapods teeth that theraopds would have lips, yet mosasaurs who ARE related to veranids no one seems to want to put lips on those reconstructions- I think that the argument that they would need lips to protect the teeth goes out the window if the teeth end up sticking out of those lips anyways, what's the point? |
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Post by dinonikes on Aug 31, 2011 22:47:10 GMT
I would say it is probably a bigger chance that T. rex was lip-less. Did its jaws resemble those of a crocodile? Looking at a skull of a crocodile, the area between the teeth is rather round/smooth in shape whereas on T. rex the line is quite sharp. The T. rex also has several small holes along the jaw line which are non-present on a crocodile jaw. This is what makes me hesitate a bit about it being completely lip-less. However this sculpture of a lip-less Sue certainly looks convincing! Crocs do have some small holes along their upper and lower jaws but not as pronounced or as organized in a row as the ones on therapods. but like I said before, mammals have none, or maybe one or two, and duckbills have them at the tips of their bills on their skulls, so I dont think these holes are dead set argument for lips like some I have read claim them to be- |
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Sept 1, 2011 3:53:50 GMT
I personally don't see why lips are needed to " protect " teeth ? Lots of animals have exposed teeth and suffer no ill effects. Large lips can be a breeding ground for bacteria which open air kills. I'm good with them being lip-less until I hear some better proof.
Some I've read do say these skulls have been crushed and squashed..but I would bet they have been restored to the point that's not a major factor in a lips/no lips issue.
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Post by robban on Sept 1, 2011 22:03:55 GMT
A Tyrannosaurus rex wouldn't need to protect its teeth though, it had a lifetime supply of them. If you break one, you'll soon get a new one! A mammal needs to protect its teeth as much as possible. If you lose one, it is gone, permanently! Most of the T.rex skulls that has been found are either partial, compressed, or a mix of both. Sue's skull, was complete but badly compressed. Stan's skull is still the best T. rex skull ever found,100% complete As the skull was totally disarticulated the bones in the skull has not suffered any compression. Here's my 1/6 scale Stan skull from BHI. What a beauty!  |
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Post by Seijun on Sept 1, 2011 22:08:29 GMT
What do the dark tips on the teeth represent?
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Post by robban on Sept 1, 2011 22:30:44 GMT
The black represents the enamel.
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Post by Seijun on Sept 2, 2011 4:22:14 GMT
Did the gumline extend all the way to the black parts??
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Post by robban on Sept 2, 2011 21:45:12 GMT
I think the teeth are sticking out too much. Perhaps ther is some enamel missing as well? Two-thirds of the tooth is root. They were deeply ancored in the jaw. Stan seems to suffer from tooth loss as most of the root is visible.  |
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Post by Griffin on Sept 16, 2011 13:58:45 GMT
I guess Rex had lizard-like lips but not as developed as in varanids (roughly like in JP), mainly to protect the gums and teeth. Or maybe not, but considering their jaw structure, most if not all theropod had their upper teeth sticking out. I find it sort of interesting that although therapods are not directly related (I may be wrong here) to veranids, I have heard people use the argument that since their teeth are so similar to therapods teeth that theraopds would have lips, yet mosasaurs who ARE related to veranids no one seems to want to put lips on those reconstructions- I think that the argument that they would need lips to protect the teeth goes out the window if the teeth end up sticking out of those lips anyways, what's the point? I def think mosasaurs had lips. I put them on there in my reconstructions. |
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Post by brucewoollatt on Sept 18, 2011 1:41:43 GMT
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Post by simon on Nov 16, 2011 18:40:50 GMT
Malcolm - a suggestion:
What do you think about putting spikes along the TRexes' back much like you did with the Supersaurus or Jon Rader has done with his 1/20 Sue sculpt?
I think it would give it a really distinctive look and aesthetically really make it stand out when compared with the 'usual 1/40 TRexes'!
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Nov 17, 2011 3:25:10 GMT
I love spines/ spikes on theropods..but they can be a pain to cast.
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Post by raderstudios on Nov 26, 2011 7:02:09 GMT
Hey guys,
I just thought I could offer some insight here, as this is something that I had to look into carefully while working on my Stan model a while ago. I also employed the knowledge that I gained on my recent Sue model.
When an animal dies and becomes buried, it's bones may be exposed to repeated soaking and drying. When this (along with other forms of decay) occurs, it can weaken the bond between teeth and the jaws that bear them, allowing them to slip out of the sockets. Then, (as is the case with Stan) when they are fossilized, the spaces between the teeth fill in with sediment making it appear that the teeth are in the position that they were during life, when in actuality, much of what is now visible is root. The enamel caps on the teeth are all that should be exposed above the gum line (unless the tooth is about to fall out and be replaced).
Looking forward to seeing the completed sculpture!
Cheers,
Jon
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Post by dinonikes on Feb 24, 2012 6:25:18 GMT
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Feb 24, 2012 8:07:07 GMT
Nice piece Malcolm !
Such a step up in detail ..the 3rd pic is my favorite angle. ;D
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Pixelboy
Junior Member
Prodigious!
Posts: 55
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Post by Pixelboy on Feb 24, 2012 15:26:32 GMT
Fantastic work Can't wait to see it painted! |
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