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Post by foxilized on Feb 26, 2011 20:50:28 GMT
Foxlilized, don't forget the one about Lex Murphy (being played by Keira Knightley). Well as far as I know that was just a rumor from the 1st draft era (2003, the story with Pteranodons invading a city). I always saw that Keira new as just a rumor but maybe you have a source/link of it being confirmed, or sort of official? As far as I know, the official/confirmed cast for that 2003 1st draft were: -Malcom -Grant -Hammond Anyway if you do have a link for the Keira new, I'll be really thankful.
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Post by sbell on Feb 26, 2011 21:32:51 GMT
Foxlilized, don't forget the one about Lex Murphy (being played by Keira Knightley). Well as far as I know that was just a rumor from the 1st draft era (2003, the story with Pteranodons invading a city). I always saw that Keira new as just a rumor but maybe you have a source/link of it being confirmed, or sort of official? As far as I know, the official/confirmed cast for that 2003 1st draft were: -Malcom -Grant -Hammond Anyway if you do have a link for the Keira new, I'll be really thankful. There is no such thing as any confirmed anything for JP4--again, it's like Ghostbusters 3; it rises up once in a while, people get excited, then it goes away again.
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Post by foxilized on Mar 7, 2011 4:48:31 GMT
Er, there's "official" info and then there's fandom rumors. If an article explains Universal have contacted Sam Neill to perform Grant in a movie project, that's "oficial info". If a fan posts a new in his blog where he says he heard somewhere somebody saying Keira could be the star of a new movie, that's eveyrhing but "official". I was asking for trustable article reading Keira was actually a true Universal choice for the project. That's what I meant, thought it was clear.
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Post by foxilized on Mar 7, 2011 10:36:58 GMT
Such as this: www.killermovies.com/j/jurassicpark4/articles/3273.htmlThat's what I was talking about. As you can see, that's a 2003 new. It belongs to the very 1st Draft of the screenplay. There was about 5, 6 or more drafts from that to today. Still not even one satisfied Spielberg or/and the fans. Arianna Richards was thought to play Lex on 2005, btw. Keira wasn't contacted again after 2003 as far as I know. Today we don't even know if Lex is still supposed to be there at all.
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Post by roselaar on Mar 7, 2011 13:10:14 GMT
I hope they leave Lex out of it, she's one of the least likely and lovable returning characters possible.
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Post by sbell on Mar 7, 2011 13:19:09 GMT
I hope they leave Lex out of it, she's one of the least likely and lovable returning characters possible. At this point, it's more likely to get rebooted than sequelled--if it ever goes beyond the rumour stage (and if it does, considering how many different scripts and treatments have already been put forward, it will probably be a bigger mess than JP3). And Lex was still less annoying than Tim. Although, really, it wouldn't be a JP movie without some sort of annoying child in peril (that you know for sure isn't actually in peril; this ain't exactly Jaws).
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Post by Horridus on Mar 7, 2011 15:20:20 GMT
Kelly Malcolm wins hands down in the 'annoying JP child' stakes. No fault of the actor, really, it's a rather unlikeable part (especially the unlikely Velociraptor impaling).
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 7, 2011 21:22:48 GMT
She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol
Really the kids in the first film were fine..much better than in the novel...and they worked so well with Sam Neill's character. The 2nd film..Kelly didn't have a chance..her role was orig two characters, older than she was, more knowledgeable..actually useful.
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Post by foxilized on Mar 7, 2011 22:24:58 GMT
She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol Really the kids in the first film were fine..much better than in the novel...and they worked so well with Sam Neill's character. The 2nd film..Kelly didn't have a chance..her role was orig two characters, older than she was, more knowledgeable..actually useful. Not that useful... The kids on the second novel were pretty much innecessary, but one assumes Crichton was just repeting the success formula without caring that much on literary quality. It was a totally made-for-the-money novel so I imagine he opted for not breaking his head too much and just take elements from both his first novel and the JP film, mix them a little, add some new interesting Malcom speeches and let the fandom JPmania add what lacks. Similar to how Spielberg did the TLW film, we might assume. And still the TLW novel was infinitely better than the film version. For the record: I love both, I even love JP3. I am aware of the big flaws, but I still love them. ^_^ She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol ;D True! (If you don't count the park workers shooting at the raptor at the beginning of JP1... "shoot her!!!" These guys had electric sticks but also guns... and I guess Muldoon was meaning to kill her, wasn't he?) But yeah... In Spielberg's world we have kids killing dinosaurs, instead of the other way around. ;D Only in Jaws you can see a kid being killed... Or maybe in Schlinder's list... Beyond that, kids on Spielberg's world are sort of immortal. Remember the beginning of TLW? Like 50 poisonous compys eating alive a little girl, then in next scene good old Santa Hammond goes "don't worry, she's perfectly fine!" In the novel was pretty different... Compys eating human babies!!!!! ----------------------------- Some updates: Lex was only thought to appear on the very first 2003 draft of "JP4". Not later. Keira was thought to play Lex but since Lex was not a major role she was also thought to play an alternate more important female character and so Arianna would play Lex at the start of the film. Other characters would be Grant, Malcom, Nick Van Owen and Hammond. In the 2nd Draft, there would be no known characters but a Hammond cameo. The star would be a military mercerany. The plot would include Intelligent Human-Dinosaurs with heavy guns ala Dinoriders. In the 3rd Draft the star would be Ellie Sattler. Besides her, Malcom and Hammond. That's all. Human-Dinosaurs with guns also included. In the current last draft, no known characters are thought to appear. The plot is unknown. No Human-Dinosaur soldiers involved thank god. But the Human-Dinosaur soldiers script is planned to be used in subsequent sequels if the JP4 movie is succesful. (Oh no... ) This is all we know from official sources. Believe me, I've made the most disciplinated research on the web. No other internet source has a more accurate info than this. (Yeah I might sound a little pretentious but I've spend like a week of research on this, believeme.)
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Post by sbell on Mar 7, 2011 22:28:50 GMT
She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol Really the kids in the first film were fine..much better than in the novel...and they worked so well with Sam Neill's character. The 2nd film..Kelly didn't have a chance..her role was orig two characters, older than she was, more knowledgeable..actually useful. Not that useful... The kids on the second novel were pretty much innecessary, but one assumes Crichton was just repeting the success formula without caring that much on literary quality. It was a totally made-for-the-money novel so I imagine he opted for not breaking his head too much and just take elements from both his first novel and the JP film, mix them a little, add some new interesting Malcom speeches and let the fandom JPmania add what lacks. Similar to how Spielberg did the TLW film, we might assume. And still the TLW novel was infinitely better than the film version. For the record: I love both, I even love JP3. I am aware of the big flaws, but I still love them. ^_^ She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol ;D True! (If you don't count the park workers shooting at the raptor at the beginning of JP1... "shoot her!!!" These guys had electric sticks but also guns... and I guess Muldoon was meaning to kill her, wasn't he?) But yeah... In Spielberg's world we have kids killing dinosaurs, instead of the other way around. ;D Only in Jaws you can see a kid being killed... Or maybe in Schlinder's list... Beyond that, kids on Spielberg's world are sort of immortal. Remember the beginning of TLW? Like 50 poisonous compys eating alive a little girl, then in next scene good old Santa Hammond goes "don't worry, she's perfectly fine!" In the novel was pretty different... Compys eating human babies!!!!! ----------------------------- Some updates: Lex was only thought to appear on the very first 2003 draft of "JP4". Not later. Keira was thought to play Lex but since Lex was not a major role she was also thought to play an alternate more important female character and so Arianna would play Lex at the start of the film. Other characters would be Grant, Malcom, Nick Van Owen and Hammond. In the 2nd Draft, there would be no known characters but a Hammond cameo. The star would be a military mercerany. The plot would include Intelligent Human-Dinosaurs with heavy guns ala Dinoriders. In the 3rd Draft the star would be Ellie Sattler. Besides her, Malcom and Hammond. That's all. Human-Dinosaurs with guns also included. In the current last draft, no known characters are thought to appear. The plot is unknown. No Human-Dinosaur soldiers involved thank god. But the Human-Dinosaur soldiers script is planned to be used in subsequent sequels if the JP4 movie is succesful. (Oh no... ) This is all we know from official sources. Believe me, I've made the most disciplinated research on the web. No other internet source has a more accurate info than this. (Yeah I might sound a little pretentious but I've spend like a week of research on this, believeme.) Unless you are being given studio press releases, most of your research will be for naught--rumours on the internet, even ones based on supposed insider info, aren't worth much.
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 7, 2011 23:29:08 GMT
She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol Really the kids in the first film were fine..much better than in the novel...and they worked so well with Sam Neill's character. The 2nd film..Kelly didn't have a chance..her role was orig two characters, older than she was, more knowledgeable..actually useful. Not that useful... The kids on the second novel were pretty much innecessary, but one assumes Crichton was just repeting the success formula without caring that much on literary quality. It was a totally made-for-the-money novel so I imagine he opted for not breaking his head too much and just take elements from both his first novel and the JP film, mix them a little, add some new interesting Malcom speeches and let the fandom JPmania add what lacks. Similar to how Spielberg did the TLW film, we might assume. And still the TLW novel was infinitely better than the film version. For the record: I love both, I even love JP3. I am aware of the big flaws, but I still love them. ^_^ She was the first human to kill a dinosaur in the series...so of course we don't like her... lol ;D True! (If you don't count the park workers shooting at the raptor at the beginning of JP1... "shoot her!!!" These guys had electric sticks but also guns... and I guess Muldoon was meaning to kill her, wasn't he?) But yeah... In Spielberg's world we have kids killing dinosaurs, instead of the other way around. ;D Only in Jaws you can see a kid being killed... Or maybe in Schlinder's list... Beyond that, kids on Spielberg's world are sort of immortal. Remember the beginning of TLW? Like 50 poisonous compys eating alive a little girl, then in next scene good old Santa Hammond goes "don't worry, she's perfectly fine!" In the novel was pretty different... Compys eating human babies!!!!! Recall in the first novel the little girl didn't die either.. Though some babies and toddlers were killed/eaten. The kids are really a jumping off point in the narration. They ask the questions that some younger readers would be asking themselves. A mixed age groups allows you to get in touch with readers of all ages. Muldoon did yell to " Shoot her! " but I'm not sure they did or if they shot it actually accomplished anything. I've always assumed the one there was the Big One they released into the pen...that appears as a leader later. I love the plot holes..like there are Raptors breeding....but they only have 3 adults in a highly contained pen. lol
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Post by Horridus on Mar 8, 2011 0:14:28 GMT
Maybe there were smaller dromaeosaurs in the park that were kept in a 'normal' enclosure and were just never mentioned...? Loved Foxilized's description of 'Santa Hammond'. Hammond was made too cuddly in the film, I think. Not enough of the brutal capitalist dark side.
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 8, 2011 0:40:15 GMT
Maybe there were smaller dromaeosaurs in the park that were kept in a 'normal' enclosure and were just never mentioned...? Loved Foxilized's description of 'Santa Hammond'. Hammond was made too cuddly in the film, I think. Not enough of the brutal capitalist dark side. Oh there could have been..in the novel it was said they Raptor's were kept in normal enclosure..before some " problems " forced them to relocate the pack to a stronger pen. I despised the Hammond in the novel really...but the film version I loved. The film Hammond's charisma is what won over his investors..not by being brutal. He's a great manipulator as well..but a dreamer. His quote : " Creation is an act of sheer will.. " is taped to my monitor here..
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Post by foxilized on Mar 8, 2011 9:34:19 GMT
Unless you are being given studio press releases, most of your research will be for naught--rumours on the internet, even ones based on supposed insider info, aren't worth much. I checked every new I could find on the subject and compared it to each other to see what fits and what doesn't. There were a lot of incoherences on the news, some despite of the date and claiming it was a recent new seemed to be outdated news described earlier drafts and some other news seemed to be just fan-wishes, so I can tell I was very eskeptycal. I based it mostly on Spielberg's, Johnston's and Universal people interviews and quotes. Assuming these quotes are for real, of course, but that's the most trustable source I could find at hand. All of them came from trustable magazines or official Universal sites so I guess we can assume they are real. From these quotes I checked the rest of the avaiable info avaiable and saw what fits with the quotes and what not. This eliminated a lot of crappy info wich simply didn't fit or was contradictory and put some light on what could be taken as a fact. Also an online review of the 2nd Draft exist. Again assuming the review was for real, wich I believe it was since in the interviews and quotes of the Universal team they seem to confirm it was. The review helped a lot on identyfying two pretty different parts of the plot -a first part with dinosaurs attacking a city and a second part with a mercenary vs the troodo-sapien soldiers. Since that 2nd draft was a revision of a 1st draft wich plot was mainly dinosaurs attacking a city, it wasn't hard to figure out what belong to the 1st draft and what was added later. The 3rd draft was a revision of the 2nd, changing mostly the main characters. I checked quotes and interviews of the mentioned actors to see if they had been contacted by Universal for real at some moment. They were. Therefore the script included their characters. And finally Johnston said in a later interview the 1/2/3nd draft was being kept to be used in subsequent sequels and that they have another current script for the jp4 film. I also found concept art of the movie. It's there on the web if you know how to find it. It supports the troodon-sapiens soldiers thing and also supports other plot ideas told on the news. What I have is not "official" but it fits. I am used to work this way, I've been helping movie students doing researchs on ancient movie scripts and movies for years (John Ford's for example). A sort of archeologycal job. I love it. And I was tought how to do it by serious movie students. If you think spending 30 bucks for a Studio Press release where -and I found a person who had one to tell what was on it- the unique piece of info of the plot is "The government has been training mutated dinosaurs into soldiers" is more worthy than what I am bringin, then go ahead and spend your money. I might be amateurish, but at least I made my homework. And FOR FREE. It's not perfect and it may be not worthy in the end, but hey, I work for myself, man.
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Post by sid on Mar 8, 2011 11:06:13 GMT
I love the plot holes..like there are Raptors breeding....but they only have 3 adults in a highly contained pen. lol That wasn't a plot hole at all! Those eggs Grant found were layed by the Raptors well before the 3 remaining members of the pack were placed in the security pen... If you look at the brochure map (official source), you'll see that, at first, the Raptors had their paddock like every other animal on the island; they bred there, then the Big One went on a killing spree leaving only two dinosaurs as her, ehm, sidekicks ( ;D) and Ingen decided to move 'em to the enclosure we saw in the movie
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Post by foxilized on Mar 8, 2011 17:34:07 GMT
Hmm, I feel like I want to apologize for my previous egotistic rant... Sounded like I was trying to sell myself or something. In truth, I found bothering that no page in the whole web had a decent list of the JP4 info avaiable to the present, my irrational love for the franchise made me very curious on knowing what's going on there, but I couldn't find anything wich was made with enough dedication and informative enough. My intention during this research was simply joining the facts around and create a simple and clear list of facts. Just for me and for others who could also be interested on knowing. If I defended myself so too passionately is because I didn't want you to think I was inventing bs. I love the plot holes..like there are Raptors breeding....but they only have 3 adults in a highly contained pen. lol That wasn't a plot hole at all! Those eggs Grant found were layed by the Raptors well before the 3 remaining members of the pack were placed in the security pen... If you look at the brochure map (official source), you'll see that, at first, the Raptors had their paddock like every other animal on the island; they bred there, then the Big One went on a killing spree leaving only two dinosaurs as her, ehm, sidekicks ( ;D) and Ingen decided to move 'em to the enclosure we saw in the movie Hmmmmm I have just one objection to that: then some of the raptors had to have mutate into males to copulate, before being taken to the enclosure... And the people on the park had to know they had changed sexes when they took them to the enclosure, but they don't know they are changing sexes and refer to all of them as females... So if all the raptors are females, who the hell "did the thing"? Hmmm maybe raptors changed sex and they looked identical as females in a quick look so when they took them to the enclosure they didn't have anything to realize some were actually males... but.... hmmm, I don't know.....
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 8, 2011 19:29:12 GMT
I love the plot holes..like there are Raptors breeding....but they only have 3 adults in a highly contained pen. lol That wasn't a plot hole at all! Those eggs Grant found were layed by the Raptors well before the 3 remaining members of the pack were placed in the security pen... If you look at the brochure map (official source), you'll see that, at first, the Raptors had their paddock like every other animal on the island; they bred there, then the Big One went on a killing spree leaving only two dinosaurs as her, ehm, sidekicks ( ;D) and Ingen decided to move 'em to the enclosure we saw in the movie I view it as a " plot hole " since it wasn't directly referenced in the film. The only way the audience would know that's why they are there would be hear it from the actor's mouths, or have read the novel..which the film didn't really follow anyway. We're left to surmise somehow those three Raptors or the ones before somehow escaped and laid eggs then made it back in ?
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Post by zopteryx on Mar 9, 2011 0:28:36 GMT
I'm really hoping they don't go into dino-sapiens at all, save that for another movie with a fresh plot. Here are a few alternate theories I've come up with. 1. The plot would have to do with people exploiting the islands illegally; people ranging from thrill-seekers to hunters to scientists to convicts. They have little colonies on the islands and are constantly squabbling with their neighbors and dinos. Somehow the original main characters get dragged into it and have to save the islands, the animals, and the people; as usual. 2. Ingen secretly had some marine reptiles (not on "the list" like Spino). They have escaped their pens and now are causing havoc around the world, starting with the boat in JP3. 3. One of these theories on a new island (they referenced 5 in TLW). Maybe they have a new top predator for each island. 4. Ingen was trying to make super dinos or something, which leads us back to dino-sapiens and bad things happen .
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Post by zopteryx on Mar 9, 2011 0:32:22 GMT
I view it as a " plot hole " since it wasn't directly referenced in the film. The only way the audience would know that's why they are there would be hear it from the actor's mouths, or have read the novel..which the film didn't really follow anyway. We're left to surmise somehow those three Raptors or the ones before somehow escaped and laid eggs then made it back in ? Do they ever say that they're raptor eggs? I know the footprints look like raptor prints, but maybe that was just a slip up and they're supposed to be something else, like Gallimimus perhaps.
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 9, 2011 3:04:47 GMT
I view it as a " plot hole " since it wasn't directly referenced in the film. The only way the audience would know that's why they are there would be hear it from the actor's mouths, or have read the novel..which the film didn't really follow anyway. We're left to surmise somehow those three Raptors or the ones before somehow escaped and laid eggs then made it back in ? Do they ever say that they're raptor eggs? I know the footprints look like raptor prints, but maybe that was just a slip up and they're supposed to be something else, like Gallimimus perhaps. Not that I can find, he does say they are Dinosaur eggs, but the tracks leading away were raptor tracks..two toed from what I recall. They should have tossed in a baby there somewhere like they did in the novel to help explain it better. Wild-bred Raptors should also have played some part in the film.
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