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Post by timlee3005 on Mar 26, 2009 22:07:43 GMT
Nah,since Bakker doesn't own a copyright on Utahraptor,his blessing isn't really needed. ;D Speaking of Utahraptor,that's really the only dromaeosaur I can think of that can be done in 1/40th scale without being tiny,unlike Deinonychus,a contemporary of Acrocanthosaurus. It's more like a marketing tool--Bob Bakker approves this set! It would be like having Phil Currie's approval on a T.rex figure...Malcolm, contact me ;D While I have much respect for Robert Bakker,it just so happens that I dissagree with many of his ideas like his aquatic Ceratosaurus theory,and wouldn't want to see them incorporated into this line. |
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Post by Tyrannax on Mar 26, 2009 22:13:34 GMT
But some of his theories are accepted by many people. Why not take after these?
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Post by timlee3005 on Mar 26, 2009 22:22:26 GMT
But some of his theories are accepted by many people. Why not take after these? There are some ideas of his I don't agree with,like his older theory of Stegosaurus flapping it's plates up and down to ward off predators,or more recent ones like Allosaurus running into the flanks of sauropods with it's mouth open,using it's own head and open jaws as a sort of "hatchet". But as you say,he does have his share of good ideas too. His having worked closely with the specimen of Brachylophosaurus known as "Leonardo", has made Bakker among the best candidates to consult with when it comes to hadrosaurids,(which lived later in the Cretaceous that the fearsome carnivore Acrocanthosaurus atokensis.) No matter where this thread goes,even if it turns into STAR WARS, the Acrocanthosaurus will always find it's way back again! |
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 27, 2009 0:33:36 GMT
I didn't mean have him consult and do versions of all the figures... I just meant contact him, get his approval to actually call a set the Raptor Red set...would give some nice colorful tags, attach a well-known paleontologist to it, maybe even get some more interest in the film again... he would prob give the go ahead and it would be free.
I didn't mean to give him any control over the figures .... kind of like the Safari T-Rex Named Sue items... they got to use the name and make figures of their choosing.
Just a thought.
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Post by timlee3005 on Mar 27, 2009 0:54:32 GMT
Now that would be a movie I would want to see.
It would make a unique movie experience.
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 27, 2009 3:18:50 GMT
I think doing it in IMAX 3D would be even better now... or release it in both.. seeing through the eyes of a Raptor would be really cool... ;D
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Post by timlee3005 on Mar 27, 2009 3:58:05 GMT
Much like those Japanese hosts on MXC would say badly dubbed in English ,"Right you are Ken.......Indeed"
Imagine how bad those Utahraptors would crap themselves if they suddenly came upon Acrocanthosaurus....
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Mar 27, 2009 5:39:11 GMT
In the book they have several encounters with Acros...you could almost say Acros play the villians I guess. One mated pair of them go to kill the Utahraptors just because they are too close to where they want to nest.... there is also another really funny scene with a young male Acro and juvenile Raptor up a tree.... " Rattle the Raptor ! " ... LOL ;D
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Apr 2, 2009 2:38:21 GMT
Here's another of Brett's Acros for inspiration..   |
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Post by Meso-Cenozoic on Apr 2, 2009 10:32:55 GMT
Oooo, Blade! That is one bad-ass Acro!!! (Although, for some reason, he does kinda remind me a little of the American version of Godzilla, lol!)
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Post by Tyrannax on Apr 2, 2009 17:14:25 GMT
They renamed the American version of Godzilla, "Zilla".  It is not Godzilla according to a massive fight by the creators of Gojira, and the producers of Godzilla the movie of 98. ;D |
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Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Apr 2, 2009 20:09:51 GMT
And dinonikes, I think you should read up on the acrocantho's arms, as there has been a lot discovered about them... "Like those of most other non-avian theropods, Acrocanthosaurus forelimbs did not make contact with the ground and were not used for locomotion; instead they served a predatory function. The discovery of a complete forelimb (NCSM 14345) allowed the first analysis of the function and range of motion of the forelimb in Acrocanthosaurus.[24] The study examined the bone surfaces which would have articulated with other bones to determine how far the joints could move without dislocating. In many of the joints, the bones did not fit together exactly, indicating the presence of a considerable amount of cartilage in the joints, as is seen in many living archosaurs. Among other findings, the study suggested that, in a resting position, the forelimbs would have hung from the shoulders with the humerus angled backwards slightly, the elbow bent, and the claws facing medially (inwards).[24] The shoulder of Acrocanthosaurus was limited in its range of motion compared to that of humans. The arm could not swing in a complete circle, but could retract (swing backwards) 109° from the vertical, so that the humerus could actually be angled slightly upwards. Protraction (swinging forwards) was limited to only 24° past the vertical. The arm was unable reach a vertical position when adducting (swinging downwards), but could abduct (swing upwards) to 9° above horizontal. Movement at the elbow was also limited compared to humans, with a total range of motion of only 57°. The arm could not completely extend (straighten), nor could it flex (bend) very far, with the humerus unable even to form a right angle with the forearm. The radius and ulna (forearm bones) locked together so that there was no possibility of pronation or supination (twisting) as in human forearms.[24] None of the carpals (wrist bones) fit together precisely, suggesting the presence of a large amount of cartilage in the wrist, which would have stiffened it. All of the digits were able to hyperextend (bend backwards) until they nearly touched the wrist. When flexed, the middle digit would converge towards the first digit, while the third digit would twist inwards. The first digit of the hand bore the largest claw, which was permanently flexed so that it curved back towards the underside of the hand. Likewise, the middle claw may have been permanently flexed, while the third claw, also the smallest, was able to both flex and extend.[24] After determining the ranges of motion in the joints of the forelimb, the study went on to hypothesize about the predatory habits of Acrocanthosaurus. The forelimbs could not swing forward very far, unable even to scratch the animal's own neck. Therefore they were not likely to have been used in the initial capture of prey and Acrocanthosaurus probably led with its mouth when hunting. On the other hand, the forelimbs were able to retract towards the body very strongly. Once prey had been seized in the jaws, the heavily-muscled forelimbs may have retracted, holding the prey tightly against the body and preventing escape. As the prey animal attempted to pull away, it would only have been further impaled on the permanently flexed claws of the first two digits. The extreme hyperextensibility of the digits may have been an adaptation allowing Acrocanthosaurus to hold struggling prey without fear of dislocation. Once the prey was trapped against the body, Acrocanthosaurus may have dispatched it with its jaws. Another possibility is that Acrocanthosaurus held its prey in its jaws, while repeatedly retracting its forelimbs, tearing large gashes with its claws.[24]" What I have found on wikipedia, I think it is good info.  |
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Apr 2, 2009 20:24:28 GMT
Oooo, Blade! That is one bad-ass Acro!!! (Although, for some reason, he does kinda remind me a little of the American version of Godzilla, lol!) Brett's Dinos are really nice...at JPL we were asking if he would be interested in a JP comic series or something along those lines...anyone interested could head over to DA and let him know... ;D It's not that certain therapods look like Zilla...it's that Zilla was designed to look like therapod dinosaurs... how many times I've corrected people...heh... especially after the Papo Allo came out...lol |
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Post by stoneage on Apr 2, 2009 23:42:51 GMT
And dinonikes, I think you should read up on the acrocantho's arms, as there has been a lot discovered about them... "Like those of most other non-avian theropods, Acrocanthosaurus forelimbs did not make contact with the ground and were not used for locomotion; instead they served a predatory function. The discovery of a complete forelimb (NCSM 14345) allowed the first analysis of the function and range of motion of the forelimb in Acrocanthosaurus.[24] The study examined the bone surfaces which would have articulated with other bones to determine how far the joints could move without dislocating. In many of the joints, the bones did not fit together exactly, indicating the presence of a considerable amount of cartilage in the joints, as is seen in many living archosaurs. Among other findings, the study suggested that, in a resting position, the forelimbs would have hung from the shoulders with the humerus angled backwards slightly, the elbow bent, and the claws facing medially (inwards).[24] The shoulder of Acrocanthosaurus was limited in its range of motion compared to that of humans. The arm could not swing in a complete circle, but could retract (swing backwards) 109° from the vertical, so that the humerus could actually be angled slightly upwards. Protraction (swinging forwards) was limited to only 24° past the vertical. The arm was unable reach a vertical position when adducting (swinging downwards), but could abduct (swing upwards) to 9° above horizontal. Movement at the elbow was also limited compared to humans, with a total range of motion of only 57°. The arm could not completely extend (straighten), nor could it flex (bend) very far, with the humerus unable even to form a right angle with the forearm. The radius and ulna (forearm bones) locked together so that there was no possibility of pronation or supination (twisting) as in human forearms.[24] None of the carpals (wrist bones) fit together precisely, suggesting the presence of a large amount of cartilage in the wrist, which would have stiffened it. All of the digits were able to hyperextend (bend backwards) until they nearly touched the wrist. When flexed, the middle digit would converge towards the first digit, while the third digit would twist inwards. The first digit of the hand bore the largest claw, which was permanently flexed so that it curved back towards the underside of the hand. Likewise, the middle claw may have been permanently flexed, while the third claw, also the smallest, was able to both flex and extend.[24] After determining the ranges of motion in the joints of the forelimb, the study went on to hypothesize about the predatory habits of Acrocanthosaurus. The forelimbs could not swing forward very far, unable even to scratch the animal's own neck. Therefore they were not likely to have been used in the initial capture of prey and Acrocanthosaurus probably led with its mouth when hunting. On the other hand, the forelimbs were able to retract towards the body very strongly. Once prey had been seized in the jaws, the heavily-muscled forelimbs may have retracted, holding the prey tightly against the body and preventing escape. As the prey animal attempted to pull away, it would only have been further impaled on the permanently flexed claws of the first two digits. The extreme hyperextensibility of the digits may have been an adaptation allowing Acrocanthosaurus to hold struggling prey without fear of dislocation. Once the prey was trapped against the body, Acrocanthosaurus may have dispatched it with its jaws. Another possibility is that Acrocanthosaurus held its prey in its jaws, while repeatedly retracting its forelimbs, tearing large gashes with its claws.[24]" What I have found on wikipedia, I think it is good info. CT can you either draw us a picture or show us the correct way Acrocanthosaurus looked. |
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Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Apr 3, 2009 0:13:14 GMT
Well, just nothing extreme-- No scratching it's neck with it's hands, no over-flexed wrists-- Generic theropod arm stance would probably work. If it was attacking a prey animal, it would trap it close to it's body and kill it with it's jaws. It's humerus could extend a little above horizontal backwards, almost like the papo allosaur.
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Post by Blade-of-the-Moon on Apr 3, 2009 3:17:02 GMT
Was Allosaurus the same then ? If so this might have more bearing in the Allo thread where Malcolm plans to do them in diff poses. The Acro pose he already has looks fine from what I can tell.
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Post by Tyrannax on Apr 3, 2009 4:01:56 GMT
Theropods may have not used their arms for holding on, Cordylus. Holding strong prey may have meant injuries to the arms and body from the struggling animal. Not only this, but many theropods like Tyrannosaurus did not use their arms for hunting whatsoever. (Due to the size of course) I have read several times the arms of large theropods may have been used for slashing, mating, and foraging though carcasses. I will try to find the article, or multiple articles that list the problems that could result from holding prey. One of them I believe was the fact that upon holding large prey, the head would be so close that it would make it difficult to arch back and bite into the animal. Also, quick head movements and agility would mean holding on would be useless and probably risky to the predator when it can simply bite and back away.
Remember, a predator may seem slow, but its prey is probably slower.
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Post by tetonbabydoll on Apr 3, 2009 6:32:55 GMT
That hump on its back sure does increase the mass of the critter by a lot, doesn't it?
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Post by [][][]cordylus[][][] on Apr 3, 2009 20:27:31 GMT
Theropods may have not used their arms for holding on, Cordylus. Holding strong prey may have meant injuries to the arms and body from the struggling animal. Not only this, but many theropods like Tyrannosaurus did not use their arms for hunting whatsoever. (Due to the size of course) I have read several times the arms of large theropods may have been used for slashing, mating, and foraging though carcasses. I will try to find the article, or multiple articles that list the problems that could result from holding prey. One of them I believe was the fact that upon holding large prey, the head would be so close that it would make it difficult to arch back and bite into the animal. Also, quick head movements and agility would mean holding on would be useless and probably risky to the predator when it can simply bite and back away. Remember, a predator may seem slow, but its prey is probably slower. Read what I posted. Acrocanthosaurus, and I am only talking about acro, couldn't make it's arms go too far forward-- Not even enough to scratch the neck. However, it could swing it's arms back very powerfully and far. That suggests, along with the first digit that has an inward facing claw and that can fold back to touch the hand, that acrocanthosaurus could have potentially grabbed onto prey, "hooked" them with their claws, and quickly dispatched them with their jaws. That is what all the evidence points to anyway. I was never talking about any theropod other than acrocanthosaurus. |
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Post by Tyrannax on Apr 3, 2009 21:41:25 GMT
I am talking of mainly Carnosaurs like Allosaurus and Acrocanthosaurus. One Carnosaur had a rip in its arm. (Was it Big Al?) Besides the theory that the animal had been in a fight with its own species, another theory is the arm was torn while trying to wrestle prey. Allosaurs' arms would have been much to weak to hold animals of its own size down if they were in the situation of fighting, or being eaten alive. Thrashing would have been a main means of escape if an Allosaurus were to try to hold one down. And the prey, depending on the size, could easily injure the arm in the process. The enlarged claw on each hand may have been used for slashing versus holding.
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It is not Godzilla according to a massive fight by the creators of Gojira, and the producers of Godzilla the movie of 98. ;D ![[][][]cordylus[][][] Avatar](http://files.sharenator.com/Troll_Face_U_MAD_RE_wrestling_1-s407x405-126802.jpg)
